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Slavia · Moderator

Here we go again.

I bought the Titan in March to try out the gas piston. After about 200 rounds I decided that I like it and will keep it.

The stock is comfortable. The grip angle feels good, the comb is at the right height for the scope mounts that were provided, and the lines are attractive. It could have a little more reach from the butt to the trigger. Finish is adequate, but there are places where curved lines aren't faired smoothly, and there are some sanding marks that run cross-grain.

Metal finish is like other Crosman guns. There is a lot of recoil, but it is smooth and without vibration. The firing cycle feels short compared to my other metal spring guns. It averages 708 FPS with RWS .22 Superdomes after 200 rounds - about what other people have reported.

I can't speak to accuracy yet, because the trigger is absolutely horrible and prevents me from seeing what the gun is capable of. It is rough, wobbly, and travels through a long arc. At the point where the sear disengages the trigger is moving perceptibly upwards.

So...that's where I will start.

SMP · Silver Status Member

awesome project Slav...there is only about a billion of us that can follow along on this one

Mr. Green

Slavia · Moderator

I want to set this gun up for carrying in the woods, so a functioning safety is more important than in a range situation. I added a trigger shoe (from a burner that wasn't seeing much use). A trigger shoe doesn't reduce pull, but it spreads the force out over more nerves in your finger so it feels lighter. Most of my guns have them. The drawback was that it made the safety very awkward to operate - you have to dig your finger in between the trigger and safety to take it off, and that risks pushing the trigger backwards.

Gently bending the safety blade forward helped a little, but the real solution came one day at the range, where a friend was shooting his French MAS 49-56:

I took a socket head screw from the junkbox, turned the threads off, and filed a flat so I could solder it to the original safety blade. (I used my usual method of turning the screw in a drill while grinding on it with a Dremel.) After soldering I trimmed it with the Dremel so it would match the contours of the original blade and scraped off any solder that flowed outside the joint (solder doesn't take cold blueing):

So now the safety blocks trigger movement as originally intended, but also prevents you from even putting your finger ahead of the trigger. A quick flick forward takes it off, and your finger is right in position for the trigger:

broommaster2000 · Moderator

Subtle, yet effective.

Slavia · Moderator

Since the sear broke with the trigger way back in its arc (and moving upward instead of back) I added a roller collar to the pin in the trigger blade. This moved the point of disengagement forward in the arc, but with the adjusting screw in its factory position it didn't contact the strut (intermediate sear) on cocking - so it doesn't reduce sear engagement.

So... another junkbox screw that was a perfect fit for the pin. (Sorry, I don't know what size - to duplicate this you would have to take the pin into the hardware store and find the right one.)

I turned down and smoothed the outside of the screw head:

Then I measured the internal dimension of the trigger blade and marked the head with my favorite layout ink (a permanent marker):

And finally pared off the collar with the Dremel and abrasive cutoff wheel (while spinning the screw in a drill):

Alstone · Moderator & Site Supporter

Nice project Slavia but you'll have to stop wasting your money on airguns and get a lathe, then you can go places. Cool

Al

Slavia · Moderator

Alstone · Moderator & Site Supporter

No, No , No only people with very little imagination need all them machine tools, a lathe can do anything the others can do, a bit slower I admit but you get there in the end.

It just needs a bit of self control. Laughing

Al

Slavia · Moderator

The Titan has the same trigger as its Gamo/Theoben/Crosman/Remington/B18-B19 cousins. There is an adjusting screw, but it's not really a two stage trigger. The trigger swings for quite a ways without touching anything, and then makes contact with the strut in the "second stage." This means that the trigger must have its own spring, and also that the sear can be adjusted to sit right on the point of disaster. (You can also remove the trigger spring and back the adjusting screw out so the strut always pushes against the trigger pin - this makes it a lighter single-stage trigger.)

To convert it to a true two-stage trigger (with overtravel limiter) I used the same approach as I did with my G1 and added an insert:
http://www.airgunhome.com/agforum/viewtopic.php?t=1760&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=45
I haven't had to adjust the G1's trigger for over a year, so for this iteration I opted for adjustment shims rather than a screw.

Steel stock came from my favorite parts emporium, the county recycling center. The torque arm from a bicycle coaster brake is just the right thickness to fit inside the trigger blade. (No, I did not benefit from someone's horrible accident - this was resculpted with a front end loader.)

All of this was done with a drill press, portable drill, Dremel, and various files. The pivot pin was cut from the end of the same bit that drilled the hole. The shim material was a Bush's baked bean can. The washers (to reduce side play) were cut from an aluminum soda can. The scallops on the underside of the strut (intermediate sear) were faired and polished. As with the commercial units, the trigger spring was removed.

The overtravel limiter screw is a 4-40 flathead screw that screwed right into the plastic adjustment screw block. The end of the strut has been shortened for clearance with the overtravel screw. Where before it was the threaded end of the screw that bore against the strut, now the tail end of the insert bears against the screw head:

I removed some of the trigger guard base to allow me to insert the action into the stock without removing the trigger shoe. I also drilled a hole to allow easy access to the overtravel limiter screw. The photo also shows how I trimmed the end of the safety button:

The plastic adjustment screw block (now overtravel limiter) was a friction fit, and would shift position in the trigger housing. This retainer plate was cut from an old hacksaw blade and fastened with a 4-40 screw:

The trigger works great. It is smooth, light, has a discernable difference between the stages, and breaks right after entering the second stage. It feels so good that I used up almost all of my .22 pellets "testing" it.

As nice as it is, I would not recommend that anyone else take this route. For $35 one of the commercially available replacement triggers would give the same result (minus the overtravel limiter), but with far less effort. I can justify it because I like the tinkering end of the sport, but to simply make the gun shoot smoothly go with the commercial replacements. This one took me 5 weekends, four of which didn't pan out:

I also think my next project will be a cannon, with no parts smaller than my thumb - this is reaching the dexterity limits of my pudgy little fingers.

Slavia · Moderator

A few more incidental odds and ends and I'll be caught up:

The phillips head screws that came with the scope had rounded edges in the slots, and a screwdriver would slip out easily. I got these socket head screws from the hardware store, turned them down so they would fit in the ring recesses, and re-blued:

To temporarily solve the stock reach problem I took a slip-on rubber butt pad from another gun:

As on all my break-barrel guns, I sleeved the barrel with black vinyl tubing. This is to provide grip, to protect the blueing, and to give the barrel more visual weight. (It may dampen vibration, but I have no objective or subjective data to support that.) To get the sleeve on you have to heat the vinyl with boiling water so it will stretch, and also use lubricant. Believe it or not, the best lubricant for the purpose is K-Y:

Jr. Squirreler · Veteran Member

Thanks for the Project Slav. I have been looking to buy the Titan and this is exactly what i was looking for Before i bought it. Thumb Up!

Slavia · Moderator

Jr. Squirreler · Veteran Member

Slavia · Moderator

I have had a few hundred rounds now to get used to the gun, and I found that it likes 14.3 grain Crosman Premier Hollow Points from Walmart. I'm ready to go inside the power plant, so I took the opportunity to get some baseline numbers:

Ave. Velocity = 741 FPS
Min. Velocity = 732 FPS
Max. Velocity = 753 FPS
S.D. =7.57 FPS
(17.5 FPE)

At 25 yards with the Crosman Center Point 4X32 scope:
Group Diameter (Max. dispersion between shots C-T-C) = 0.6"
Mean Diameter (Ave. distance from group center) = 0.3"
Figure of Merit (Ave. of horizontal and vertical displacement) = 0.5"

For a discussion of those measurements see Hatcher, Julian S., 1962, "Hatcher's Notebook," Stackpole Books, Mechanicsburg, PA. Ask for it at your public library through interlibrary loan and you can read it for free.

When I want numbers to describe a group I go for the computer instead of calipers. It's easy in MS Publisher to position a caliber-sized circle over each hole on a scanned image of the group. Publisher gives x and y coordinates for the hole, which are then entered in a MS Excel spreadsheet that does the calculations. (The little white box in the picture is to calibrate the image size to Publisher's grid system):

Crosman's packaging asserts that the gun has "Less Vibration," "Reduced Recoil," and "70% Less Noise." Less vibration is completely true. They're a snowflake short of a blizzard if they believe the gun has less recoil - it has plenty. "70% Less Noise" - less than what? Shooting side-by-side at the range yesterday it was only slightly quieter than my G1, and far noisier than either my Slavia 631 or Industry B3. Don't get me wrong - I like the gun, and it does everything I hoped it would. If you buy the gun based on the packaging you might find yourself being led down the garden path.

oddtodd · Silver Status Member

Mine is on the isn't as loud as my beeman RS-2, but it is louder than my crosman storm XT. The XT is more twang than anything though.