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rsterne · Moderator

OK, so I know we all (well, almost everyone) does this as a hobby.... I know that realistically, since we enjoy that hobby time, we shouldn't expect to get paid for it.... My question is, what is a well built, custom Airgun worth?.... I've kept track of the last couple of my builds, and here is a summary of my costs and the time involved:

22XX PCP HFT Rifle in .177

Parts:
2260 tube - $24
Steel breech - $40
.177 barrel - $30
HPA tank & regulator - $100
QB79 tank block - $30
2289 stock parts & carbon tubing to customize - $50
22XX trigger group. hammer, transfer port & seal, etc. (heck just buy a 2240 for all the small parts) - $70
Discovery valve & screws - $25
Discovery pressure gauge - $16
2289 hammer spring - $3
Misc. parts, screws, aluminum, etc. - $7
Bushnell 5-15 x 40 AO Legend scope - $249
Leapers medium rings - $16
TOTAL PARTS - $690.... WITHOUT THE SCOPE - $425....

Machining time (at $20/hr):
Manufacture extended valve front end with gauge port - $40
Safety modifications to QB tank block - $20
Shorten, drill, & deburr main tube - $40
Manufacture breech band & free-float barrel - $40
Modify trigger group for barrel band - $10
Deburr & polish trigger parts (including hammer), change spring, etc. - $30
Bore out Disco valve - $20
Extend bolt probe - $20
Manufacture RVA - $20
Modify foregrip - $20
Customize rear stock (raise comb, shorten, mount with screws) - $40
TOTAL TIME - $300

TOTAL COST OF PROJECT - $990.... WITHOUT THE SCOPE - $725....

When you think about what it is worth, ask yourself, what would I spend to get a .177 cal PCP for HFT that would shoot 70 shots at 20 FPE?.... What else could I purchase that could do the same job, and what would it cost?....

2260 PCP Bench Rest Rifle

Parts:
2260 - $119
Steel breech - $40
HPA tank & regulator - $100
Discovery valve & screws - $25
0-2000 psi pressure gauge - $15
Discovery hammer spring - $3
Misc. parts, screws, aluminum, etc. - $13
Bushnell 4-12 x 40 AO Legend scope - $119
Leapers medium rings - $16

TOTAL PARTS - $450.... WITHOUT THE SCOPE - $315....

Machining time (at $20/hr):
Manufacture extended valve front end - $30
Manufacture custom tank block c/w Picatinny rail - $160
Manufacture bench rest bipod - $30
Shorten, drill, & deburr main tube - $40
Manufacture barrel band & free-float barrel - $30
Deburr & polish trigger parts (including hammer), change spring, etc. - $30
Bore out Disco valve - $20
Extend bolt probe - $20
Manufacture RVA - $20
Manufacture Muzzle Brake - $40
Shorten & refinish stock - $20

TOTAL TIME - $440

TOTAL COST OF PROJECT- $890.... WITHOUT THE SCOPE - $755....

When you think about what it is worth, ask yourself, what would I spend to get a .22 cal PCP that will shoot 45 shots at 32+ FPE?.... What else could I purchase that could do the same job, and what would it cost?....

Please, keep this thread to the intended topic.... Let's share our thoughts about what you would realistically pay for guns such as this.... Are they worth the money and time it takes to build them (or have them built for you).... or are you better off to purchase something else with similar performance?.... Rolling Eyes

Bob

fritz · Silver Status Member

I'd probably pay $400 for them for average accuracy. What do they usually shoot?

If they produce excellent accuracy, I would likely pay the full price you quoted for them.

rsterne · Moderator

I haven't had the opportunity to try either one outside.... My indoor range is 20' and both guns produce ragged holes, as expected.... There is a target sitting on one of the graphs in this thread:

http://airgunhome.com/agforum/viewtopic.php?t=4524

That was shot with 10.3 gr. JSB Exact Heavy pellets.... 5 shots measuring ~0.2" OD.... ie about 0.030" C-T-C....

Thanks for your input....

Bob

fritz · Silver Status Member

One might also consider the physical dimensions of the gun. Does it fit you, so you can be accurate when shooting field target? A custom stock could easily fix that, but add another $300...

At that price, might as well buy an Air Arms, but is the AA any better?

Bob, you're an excellent craftsman, and you make works of art. There is no doubt that you have some quality builds there. It's just that, why wait 3 months for you to build one, when there are already factory guns that can do that?

bobtodrick · Member

Unfortunately I agree with one of the previous posters.
My viewpoint will be strictly a cost/benefits opinion.
I've been looking at an Air Force Condor. I can get one in Canada for $850 with a descent scope. It'll give me 40 FPE and they claim 1" or less groups at 75 yards.
Your pieces are 'works of art' and a collector would possibly pay top dollar for them.
I however would be keeping this in mind.
I would be shooting it a lot. Less money spent on the Air Force I would have the knowledge that if something crapped out, their service dept is only a UPS trip away. I'd be very conscious of the fact that if one of your's failed a year or two down the road...that depending on your personal circumstances at the time it may or may not get fixed.
And with all the custom work, if you were not in a position to repair it my local custom gunsmith would likely charge a fortune to repair it.

rws_350 · Member

you most likely wont be able to get what you put in them and definitely not with the labor. like you said, his is a hobby and building your own gun is part of the hobby so i think most people with that kind of money to spend on a gun would want to build it themself. i was looking into building my 2300kt and was offered a really great deal on an allready modded one and even though it would have saved me a ton of money to buy it over building one i still chose to build my own because that is half the fun!

Mark5043 · Silver Status Member

Those are very nice custom guns,but like others have said,I doubt you would get full price when you factor in labor.I see it kind of like custom cars/motorcycles etc.You just don't get what you put in...however,with your knowledge,and skill,I feel you COULD make money with this hobby,if you decided to specialize in custom components for a said platform... Wink

I think most would spend some money on upgrades to an existing platform.Who says you can't make money,on a hobby you love??? With your knowledge,half the battle is won.If I knew even HALF of what you do,I'd be all over it.... Mr. Green

ellodrith · Member

As posted on another board.......

The problem you will run into is that those who can most appreciate the work that you have done are the ones who do much the same thing themselves(if not at the same level of craftsmanship), and thus would be more interested in buying the parts and building to your plans . I'm an amatuer who truly appreciates reading your posts, learning from them and in turn putting some of the ideas into my own work, I would love to help out but I cannot afford those kinds of prices for an airgun (she would smoke me upside the head), I would however love to donate a few bucks to help you further yours and my knowledge of this sport.

Perhaps a raffle for the gun/s, raise some cash for your next project with the gun going as a prize in one of the gun shows/competitions that are coming up. This way you gain the cash you need, we get the ongoing access to your brain , and someone gets a phenomenal custom airgun.

cheers
Jeff

sniper · Silver Status Member

Alstone · Moderator & Site Supporter

My experience of custom building is that if the customised airgun is of good quality but follows the standard line for customising a particular model of airgun, then the price is maybe double the cost of the original gun.

If the Custom job is top notch and contains features that are not available on any other custom job of that kind, them you can name your price.

My customised Rohm pistols cost me £179 for the pistol and another £60 for materials and parts a total of £239 or $360 at present day exchange rates. I have sold two of these in the States for $530 plus p&p, and could sell many more going by the emails asking for one of these, but with me it’s the same as everything I get fed doing the same thing and go onto something else.

My Custom 2240 has generated a few requests from different parts of the world, and it is featured in this months Airgun Hobby magazine so I would expect some more requests from that, but as I said before once you have done it repeating the exercise is boring, but it does make the one off more valuable.

I’m sure Bob that your custom airguns should command a good return on cost, but you never recuperate the “time” taken doing the customisation.

After saying all that there are a lot of air gunners who want something different but don’t have the skills to do it for themselves, therefore they will pay a premium for the right custom job.

I find that the further in looks it is from the original so that people cannot identify it by looks alone them the more valuable it is, most Crosman custom jobs still look the same so there not really custom but just another variant of a standard gun.

Al

fritz · Silver Status Member

Al, you mean your "steampunk" 2240? That was a very nice pistol. Not my taste, but I can definitely see the artwork behind it.

bobtodrick · Member

alstone said "but with me it’s the same as everything I get fed doing the same thing and go onto something else"

As a shooter, this is exactly the thing I was talking about. I have looked at some of the Rohm product (in particular their rifles) and like what I see. But what you've stated above is what would stop me from buying one of your custom pistols...if something happened due to the customization in a couple of years...would you be too 'fed up' to fix it? (I'm seriously asking)
But a collector may very well be willing to spend the money.

Alstone · Moderator & Site Supporter

bobtodrick · Member

I get where you're coming from alstone.
I'm just one of those guys who buys a product to shoot (or drive, or take photo's with or listen to...the list goes on and on)...not to look at.
I'd rather impress someone with a 10m score of 585 (I wish) than a one of a kind rifle :-)

Alstone · Moderator & Site Supporter